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incident in lower twp woods
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ZER0



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 959

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:55 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

If "all" the people of the township know of the problems then why does little Miss Becky wait for a crime to come to the forefront to step up and get his publicity? He could very easily have spoken to the police any other day of the week. After all he is supposed to be the mayor and therefore responsible for the happenings throughout the twp. But as is usually the case with Becky dung-pile and the other political leaches they can't speak until they got the press at their side. Then it's throw the blame at anyone you can.
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villainesta



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 2358
Location: Wildwood Villas

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 2:33 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Quote:
Mayor Beck don't forget you are the one who personally wanted to cut the force,


Yeah and if more cops are hired and taxes go up who will be the first to complain bitterly.
There is next to no crime in the Township so why do we need more cops? Things like this unfortunate incident are going to happen and a thousand police wouldn't have prevented it.
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LTNews



Joined: 14 Oct 2012
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

The bottom line is that this township has parents that condone what their children are doing on the weekends. If you check Facebook, you can see one of the parents of a JV involved how she comments on the kids drinking. Every one of them are LT losers and are not strangers to the police. Anyone who supports them or comments on FB in support of them are losers.
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beachnutz



Joined: 27 Feb 2012
Posts: 453

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:01 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

To the person who knows who they are...Thanks for the private message.
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LTNews



Joined: 14 Oct 2012
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:18 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

beachnutz wrote:
To the person who knows who they are...Thanks for the private message.


The only certainty is all involved are animals and should be caged.
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Front Runner



Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:07 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Barracuda, I feel Lower Twp. is a great place to live and raise our families, I realize there are issues in every city and township, although I think we can all see it's getting worse. Point being TWO murders, crimes are clearly up, drugs are very bad and when you have gang members moving into our town thats a problem. Barracuda how do you feel if you needed to go to our local 7-11 at a late hour, I can tell you I would not like my parents going there! Barracuda I am def not a fan of our Cape May County Prosecutor and as far as the Task Force, well clearly they are not around. OK yes we saw a "Drug Bust" that they posted a few weeks ago, Richard Ricky Irons they arrested with Heroin. Well a user who is caught with only a few bags (personal use at best) is not making our streets safe, but at least its one! Maybe if the Prosecutors Office did there job, Irons who has been arrested many times and yes for a Large amount of Heroin prior would have been in jail. Police officers are probably not happy when they do there job and arrest these types of :: removed :: and they are right back on the streets, when they are arrested for a major crime but the good old Prosecutors office "Downgrades" the case. Point being how can a guy walk another into the woods with a gun and shovel, kill that other guy and get ONLY a five year sentense. Again, this fine young man will be right back on our streets within 3.5 years and our police officers will be right back dealing with him. Barracuda I read some of your posts and I do feel you want the best for the Twp., I feel Mayor Beck is not on the right track, we need to first make our Twp. safe. The Twp. needs to realize the problems, and work to resolve them, work together and support one another. To now speak out, to now demand action is sad after a crime of this nature has occured. Our police department years ago had many more officers, more officers to be proactive, although now when the population is so much higher and crimes are cleary higher Mayor Beck has only talked about reducing the number of officers and reducing there pay. Barracuda when the Twp. now hires a new officer at the crazy low rate that officer will probably be forced to go out and get another job to provide for there family. All this being said it is a disgrace that this crime has happened, all involved should be handled and in the right way, although my concern is the Prosecutors Office and how again they are "Downgrading" cases.
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barracuda



Joined: 08 Jun 2009
Posts: 1968

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:52 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Front runner, I believe Lower Township is a nice place to live. If I didn't believe it, I wouldn't live here.

You feel Mayor Beck is not on the right track regarding a "safe community" and then proceed to talk about the number of police officers and their pay, from this one can presume you correlate the number of officers and their pay with a "safe community." I don't believe Lower Twp. is less safe now...drug addiction is a problem everywhere.
You state years ago, we had more officers and less population. Yes this is true, but most people understand why this occurred and never should have happened. Politics and the tragic death of an officer caused officials to increase the police department by 30% over a couple of years. Almost immediately the township realized 12 more police officers was killing the budget, the taxpayers and was unsustainable. Talk of going back to the original size of the police force was met with area police unions packing council meetings in protest. In response to fiscal necessity, the Township Rescue squad department was eliminated and the privatized Lower Township Rescue Squad was created. This helped but continued reductions in the PD back to the original force was still necessary and where we are today. The township population declined from 2000 to 2010 and continues to decline. As far as the lowering of the payscale and stretching out the step inccreases; Lower township didn't invent this, many communities are doing it...as in North Wildwood. I'm sure most municipalities would like to have reduced the top scale; but they knew the police union members would never vote to approve cutting their benefits or pay...but future police officers was a different matter, and was approved by the police unions. Now future elected officials need to prevent giving it all back in future contracts.
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villainesta



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 2358
Location: Wildwood Villas

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:12 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Look you want low taxes? then you have to be prepared for a little inconvenience. Cops are EXPENSIVE and a certain amount of lawlessness is enough to pay for low taxes.Arm yourselves. We have a volunteer fire dept why not a citizens police force.
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ImWatchinU



Joined: 05 Oct 2007
Posts: 881

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:43 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

villainesta wrote:
Look you want low taxes? then you have to be prepared for a little inconvenience. Cops are EXPENSIVE and a certain amount of lawlessness is enough to pay for low taxes.Arm yourselves. We have a volunteer fire dept why not a citizens police force.


Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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beachnutz



Joined: 27 Feb 2012
Posts: 453

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:58 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

villainesta wrote:
Look you want low taxes? then you have to be prepared for a little inconvenience. Cops are EXPENSIVE and a certain amount of lawlessness is enough to pay for low taxes.Arm yourselves. We have a volunteer fire dept why not a citizens police force.


ARE YOUU CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We will have volunteers like MAX!
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Front Runner



Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:27 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Barracuda, I feel there is a problem when Chief Marker allows squads to work with only 4 and at times 3 officers during a shift. Why? Because he doesn't want to use "Overtime", the chief wants to look good in the eyes of the Mayor and Twp. manager. And to us residents that means officers are running from call to call, officers can not be proactive only reactive. Then of course you have those who call all the time because there are kids in the park, kids playing minutes after curfew etc....Yes thats our Mayor Beck who alway's calls and of course wants extra patrol in the park only because he lives right there. Then of course the Chief has his officers make mandatory property checks multiple times a nite, again taking officers away from other crimes, being proactive etc. So now you have a squad working who has a officer out on vacation, another maybe on training and if a officer is out sick the squad is extremely short handed, yet they still MUST get those park checks in, other property checks, a number of car stops then they we want them to be pro-active. And I have alway's said these officers are doing the best they can, we just need a new approach, there is no way a crime like what happened in the woods should ever happen again. And Yes, the Prosecutors Office should be held responsible for their actions or lack of. Barracuda you brought up the Prosecutors Task Force, whats your opinion? Are they doing a good job? Last how do you feel about Prosecutor Taylor?
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grandjury



Joined: 03 Sep 2010
Posts: 1276

PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:42 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

@ Lower Township - I do not know Mayor Beck, however I would like to know if Mayor Beck has requested or suggested special patrols from the Lower Police at any given time in the past Question
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barracuda



Joined: 08 Jun 2009
Posts: 1968

PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:51 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I'm not sure what you mean by "special patrols" GJ. Mayor Beck has frequently forwarded citizen provided information to the Township Manager requesting police presence for situations involving drugs, pervert solicitation for sex from male youths, destruction of property or threatening residents by male youths and so forth.

Front runner, I agree with some of your points. However, working "short" to reduce overtime costs happens everywhere. A lot of this is scheduling issues, as vacations and training should never be scheduled for the same time within the same patrol. The rest is simply to prioritize work for that short timeframe to cover the workload of an absent employee. As far as "property checks" performed by our police, I have never agreed with this policy. Property checks in Lower Township is a huge volume of work. Additionally, property checks should be an additional fee for service and not a free service provided by the PD, in my opinion. If a business wants their property checked regularly, then they should hire a security company and the same should apply to snow bird second home owners or vacationers.
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Front Runner



Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 3:59 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Barracuda as far a acheduling officers, there is always, yes always times when you have a officer on vacation and certain times there are two on vacation. Then a officer is out on training and if another calls out sick that squad has to work with only 3 or at best 4 officers. You say that shouldn't happen yet clearly it alway's does, then you should get all the facts straight, find out just what is REQUIRED during a shift. The patrol division is required to stop a # of cars, they are required to pick up Twp. and Court money and take it to the bank. They are required to do all the schools sign in's, and of course stop by the Twp. Rec and sign in and look at the big waste of tax payers money that was spent on the sub station, a sub-station that is never used. Then all the property checks, and there is much more. Point is how can we have a Pro Active police force, a police dept that can and is able to fight drugs, gangs and crime. Now the issue of "Overtime", are you saying that the little girl that this happened to in the woods is not worth "Overtime"? Are the citizens of Lower Twp. not worth "Overtime"? I will agree that in the Twp. "Overtime" needs to be reduced, althought not when it comes to safety. In Wildwood and other Twp's and Cities the Lt's and Capt's work the street, I even saw the Chief out, I think that would be a great idea, send the "Brass" out to do all the above. I think we are on something here, Yes lets see why cant the "Brass" do all the property checks, sign ins, bank details etc.??? Now the patrol officers can have more time to be pro active, to be seen around town, to target gangs and drugs. Also can you answer the questions about the prosecutors Office and Prosecutor Taylor, whats your opinion?
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barracuda



Joined: 08 Jun 2009
Posts: 1968

PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:14 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I don't know the details of your squads or the zones, Front runner; but assuming their are 6 officers on a squad at any given time, and that each of those officers have 6 weeks vacation, that is a total of 36 weeks a year. Why would a Superior officer schedule 2 officers or training within those 36 weeks, when there are 16 additional weeks in the year? Getting sick cannot be predicted, but training and vacation scheduling is basic management.
Again, I do not believe police departments should do property checks, other than township properties. This is a "freebie service" paid for by all the taxpayers to a select few individual property owners and businesses, who should contract and pay for their own security system or property management company.
I don't understand why you would take the incident in the woods and correlate it to overtime and public safety. This incident was not prevented during a regular shift or overtime. It was called in to dispatch, after the incident had occurred.
As to your question on the Prosecutor's office, I don't have first hand knowledge to form an opinion.
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Front Runner



Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:16 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Barracuda just having a respectful conversation with you. The issue of the # of officers, the non-use of overtime, the amount of work that is required from patrol officers and the issue of squads working extremely short does come into play with respect to the crime in the woods and other crime in the Twp. Its my opinion that Mayor Beck and Chief Marker should take a certain level of responsibility. As a Mayor, you always call for reducing the number of officers, when you lower the starting salary then want more and more out of less officers, clearly the level of protection the Twp. receives will go down. And shame on Chief Marker for allowing this to happen, I feel as Chief you need to stand up and fight for what you feel is needed to keep the Twp. safe! Not just agree with the twp. Manger and Mayor who wants to cut spending. So Barracuda do you feel the issue of crime, drug use and yes gang activity within the Twp. is being controlled? My answer is that it is clearly on the rise, the drug problem is out of control. The number of people addicted to pills is crazy, then of course it moves to Heroin and more, did you have a chance to read the FRONT PAGE of the Press a month or so ago? "Heroin the Top Drug in the Cape" so yes I feel we need a change in the way the Twp. fights crime and we need a better way to keep our children safe. I feel the issue of "Overtime" should never come up when it has to do with safety and our children. My opinion concerning the Prosecutors Office is there are clearly problems, when officers arrest people and put great cases together and in the end the case is downgraded, dismissed, returned to local court or a crazy low sentence is given it only makes the officers mad, discouraged and fed up in the system. Point being the Murder in the woods and the actor given a (5) year sentence and he will be out in only 3.5 years. He will be back on our streets in no time! Again I feel we need some changes.
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jefferson



Joined: 27 Mar 2013
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 3:17 pm    Post subject: no crime in lower Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

villainesta wrote:
Quote:
Mayor Beck don't forget you are the one who personally wanted to cut the force,


Yeah and if more cops are hired and taxes go up who will be the first to complain bitterly.
There is next to no crime in the Township so why do we need more cops? Things like this unfortunate incident are going to happen and a thousand police wouldn't have prevented it.

you live under a rock ? we have just as much drugs and crime as any big city
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Mumbles



Joined: 16 Mar 2010
Posts: 852

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 5:17 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

As usual, this thread is titled "incident in LT woods" but somehow has evolved into an indictment of the LT police force and the Mayor. There is NO way this tragic incident could have been prevented by the LTPD or the Mayor even if there were 50 officers on duty that night. You had a group of kids in the woods where there is no ability for the PD to patrol acting like fools/perverted criminals on alcohol and/or drugs who SHOULD have been home or at the movies or at a local ballgame. It's called parental responsibility!
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Jets Sanchez



Joined: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 314
Location: Lower Sanchez

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 7:24 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Just so Everyone is clear on something, Barracuda, AKA Janet Pitts, One Time Ward One Villas Councilwoman Candidate and Lower Township Taxpayer Association President said it here. "The Lower Township Police should only do property checks on Township Buildings!" Tell that to St Barnabas Church in the Villas who's parishioners just had all their pipes cut out from under the church! So if you are ever a victim of a stalker, burglar, or unstable person, we will remind you that you are on your own if you would like the police to check your house.
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nothingbutthetruth



Joined: 01 Aug 2010
Posts: 54

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:33 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Not sure why anyone wants to know the story- real or not- about a sexual/physical assault of a juvenile? It's really not anyone else's business but that of the kids involved and their families, and now the police of course. The police will not release any juvenile names, only the name of the person who is over 18, that's a law.

But it is a darn shame that there has been so much "victim shaming" on Facebook articles posted by the Herald. It's disgusting to see these "parents" going on rants (full of misspelled words, ebonics and slang, and just overall obscene language) "defending" their kids and putting all of the names out there for everyone to see. To be honest, it's not hard to see where the kids have learned their behavior from when you see their parents acting like 10 year olds on a public forum.
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sixpointstar



Joined: 16 Feb 2013
Posts: 1664

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:41 am    Post subject: crime in lower township Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

villainesta wrote:
Look you want low taxes? then you have to be prepared for a little inconvenience. Cops are EXPENSIVE and a certain amount of lawlessness is enough to pay for low taxes.Arm yourselves. We have a volunteer fire dept why not a citizens police force.
----------
Read this koolaid drinking person comments and please follow along well. This person comments on this, first this person claims that, there are no crimes then this person claims that, more police officer are not needed and if the town hires more officers that, Taxes will rise. Therefore the people of your area must indure the crime that, exists then to top the cake this person advises the towns people to arm themselfs with guns. This person has to been hanging with the Cat --Spaz, and that Sharky person for way to much time. Can everyone on this forum see just what kind of shape this country would be in if the likes of three person would be in leadership? You would make a fine Secretary of state for a country of one of the Kenite Tribes. KOOL Aid drinker, Are going to tell everyone in this town that at least one Police Officer that, patrols this area had no clue that, this hang out area does existe. Just maybe and I say maybe, the Mayor may have not known, but I bet you one of the kool aid package that, one at least one officer knew of this hang out spot. Why wasn't the Cat- spaz and sharky on top of this area's concern? I smell a Rat !! A lazy FAT RAT !!


Last edited by sixpointstar on Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:27 am; edited 1 time in total
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Front Runner



Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Posts: 83

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:32 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I agree, maybe a great number of officers might not have stop the incident in the woods. Although just maybe with the right amount of officers, and the officers being supported by the superiors for being proactive, and the officers not being made to do crazy number of property checks at the park (just for the Mayor) and bank details, school sign in and on and on. Maybe officers can focus on crimes, drugs, kids out getting in trouble, maybe have the time to check certain areas kids hang. Maybe, just maybe this could have been prevented. I feel when it comes to the safety of our Twp. and most importantly our kids need to be safe!! There should NEVER be a concern about "Overtime" to keep a certain number of officers on the street. remember if you only have 4 and possibly 3 officers then a domestic occurs you are down to maybe one officer. Mayor Beck is this really OK in you opinion? But I bet you will still want the Villas park watched, why only because you live right there.....
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sixpointstar



Joined: 16 Feb 2013
Posts: 1664

PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:56 am    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

When patrolling officers are short on staff the fat cats brass should step up to the plate, fill in the short fall of patrolling officers. Residents should request and demand this action of their Police force. Get the brass out on the streets. I can't believe that, not one patrolling officer did not know of this hang out place. These kids would have never done this act there if the officers would have check this spot on their patrolling route every day. These kids did this act because they knew the police don't check this spot.The chief of police should be fired, and very officer of high rank should be demoded.
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LTNews



Joined: 14 Oct 2012
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:16 am    Post subject: Re: no crime in lower Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

jefferson wrote:
villainesta wrote:
Quote:
Mayor Beck don't forget you are the one who personally wanted to cut the force,


Yeah and if more cops are hired and taxes go up who will be the first to complain bitterly.
There is next to no crime in the Township so why do we need more cops? Things like this unfortunate incident are going to happen and a thousand police wouldn't have prevented it.

you live under a rock ? we have just as much drugs and crime as any big city


I can't wait for this to go to trial. The adult female gave 3 separate interviews with 3 different networks. Each interview was different than the other. The prosecutor will have fun with her on the stand, she can't get her story straight. I may have to attend this one.
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4everBlowingBubbles



Joined: 07 Jun 2006
Posts: 2006
Location: Banned

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:09 pm    Post subject: Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

sixpointstar wrote:
When patrolling officers are short on staff the fat cats brass should step up to the plate, fill in the short fall of patrolling officers. Residents should request and demand this action of their Police force. Get the brass out on the streets. I can't believe that, not one patrolling officer did not know of this hang out place. These kids would have never done this act there if the officers would have check this spot on their patrolling route every day. These kids did this act because they knew the police don't check this spot.The chief of police should be fired, and very officer of high rank should be demoded.

Using a traffic sign on Bayshore to get people to report crimes has to be a first.
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